Interview with Rik Emmett

By Neon Blonde

September 23, 2003

"There is a connection, a strong, emotional one, maybe even somewhat nostalgic – a mutual understanding about emotions & thoughts expressed in a song, or a lick, or a lyric, and it's my gig to honor that connection, to service it, to try and revitalize it."

                                         – Rik Emmett

An Independent Spirit Triumphs

An Interview with Rik Emmett

by Amy Burch

Edited by Andie Jones

Rik Emmett was a relatively unknown singer/songwriter/guitarist on the local Toronto scene in September of 1975, when he joined the hard rock trio named Triumph. By 1979 they had three albums that had gone gold and platinum in Canada, and two of these had charted in the States, receiving serious radio airplay. By 1981, they were firmly established as one of the premier touring rock acts in North America, with generous FM radio airplay support and heavy rotation on the fledgling MTV cable channel. In the next seven years they released a total of ten albums, which all struck gold, as four of them went platinum in Canada, and two went gold Stateside. Emmett's name frequently appeared in guitar magazine polls, and he won some prestigious awards, including Best Lead Guitarist nationally in 1981. Rik left Triumph in 1988 to fly solo, but as one of the original band members, he was inducted into the Canadian Rock Hall of Fame in 1993.

With a phenomenal talent and an attitude towards excellence in his art, Rik Emmett is truly an inspiration to independent musicians… "fight the good fight every moment" is truly his way of life.  Amy Burch talked with Emmett recently about his solo career and his upcoming Dallas performance at Poor David's Pub…

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AB:  Your music career started in 1975 with you being a singer/songwriter/guitar player in Toronto.  Were you writing songs for anyone in particular or was it so you could have material to represent yourself with?

  RE:  Well, I actually got my Union Card when I was still in high school back around 1970 or 71.  But I’d always been a songwriter.  The first professional rock band that I’d played in was 1973 and by 1975 that was when Triumph started.  The context for songwriting kind of contained that and the songs that I’d written before Triumph were modified to be used in Triumph and then everything sort of becomes goal-oriented and you’re out there playing in a band writing songs for the next record.

AB:  In 1996, you did Ten Invitations from the Mistress of Mr. E – this was an instrumental classical nylon string guitar CD.  Do you feel like this was a departure from your ‘rock roots’ or had you really wanted to do something like this all along?

  RE:  More option B than option A.  I think that right from the beginning as a guitar player and as a musician, I had always liked all different kinds and styles of guitar playing and when you get popular in a rock band and play that particular style of guitar people get the impression that’s the only thing you can do.  Even in the Triumph context I’d put little classical and jazz pieces on the songs and tried to show people that I’m really not all about this kind of one-dimensional style – I really like to do a bunch of different styles.  I always thought of it in the context of music making – it’s leading you wherever it leads you and inspiration kind of leads you into a style and you don’t worry too much about the whole thing of the marketing style.  Which to say I’m not aware that it exists.  Of course, I know that’s kind of the way the world works.  Everything has to be streamed according to market.  Nevertheless, I’ve always kind of felt like I wanted to be able to do different kinds of things and try lots and lots of different styles.  And as you said, in 1996 I kind of said 'well, the mainstream music business doesn’t seem to care too much about me so I’ll just start doing my own thing.'  You know like one of those self-help books, 'do what you love and the money will follow' [both laughing] and you reach mid-life and you say 'okay maybe I’ll give that a shot and see what happens!'

  AB:  Right.  I think it’s unfortunate sometimes for musicians to get stereotyped because there are so many different styles of music.  And like you said, if you are into the classical and jazz type more than the rock and you make it successfully, people tend to think well, that’s all you can do.  And they don’t really want to listen and open up their minds to different and new things.

  RE:  Well, and its not just musicians – I mean it happens to actors and actresses.  They tend to get typecast into certain roles.  It also happens to people in their daily lives as well.  I mean, how many women come to the point in their lives where they’re like 'look I’m not just your bottle washing, housecleaning, person.  I’m not just a wife and I’m not just a mother – I’m a person, too!'  And for that frustration I think everyone can relate to that because you know the guy that has to pick up the garbage or to the plumber – 'don’t define me because of these dirty overalls I’m wearing; there’s a lot more inside me.'  I think that maybe everybody can relate to that.  I’m breaking out and I’m letting people see me from a different point of view. 

AB:  When did you come up with the idea to do a Christmas album and were you pleased with the end result?

  RE:  I was sitting on a panel doing some sort of judging with a guy named Sam Reid, whom I also sit on the Canadian Songwriter’s Board with, and Sam used to be in a very successful pop kind of band and he has his own little label and does a lot of nature music and ambient kind of music and that sort of thing.  It was keyboard sounds mixed with nature sounds (birds chirping and water babbling and soft winds blowing) that kind of thing.  And I had started doing the Invitations thing and guitar records and stuff and instrumental things, and we just started talking about it and he was saying he’d always wanted to add a Christmas album to his catalog and I said I’d always wanted to do some Christmas tunes, too and it just seemed like a natural that we would get together and share it.  My version of the record had vocals on it and for his label he took out all the vocals and we just did some guitar melody so that his mixes were a little bit different than instrumental, a little softer, and mine were a little bit more mainstream, traditional Christmas carols being sung in a traditional sort of way.

  AB:  Very cool!  So that gave the public two different styles according to what they liked to listen to.  What kind of musical styles are on 20^th Century Masters Best of Rik Emmett Collection?

  RE:  Well, when I left Triumph I guess in 1988, I guess it was 1990 when the first solo album came out, and it was starting to depart from the Triumph hard rock background but it had some rock songs on it, it had some more singer/songwriter-ish stuff on there, and then through the nineties I think I was gravitating further and further away from that.  I had record companies and record company distributors saying ‘Oh geez, Rik, you gotta put some hard rock stuff on there… we won’t be able to market it if you don’t put some hard rock stuff on there.’  But by 1993 or '94, I’d had about enough of that and I was putting out records that had ballads and more introspective type of material and a little bit more grown up stuff, and that disenchantment was sort of mutual.  Mainstream didn’t really want me and I didn’t want to have to really chase that stuff either anymore so…. But it covers the material that was on the three albums that I’d made for Duke Street, which was distributed by MCA in Canada.  And then I re-recorded some of the old Triumph songs from way back and it had some live recordings of "Hold On" and "Lay It On The Line" and "Suitcase Blues" is on there as well.  They're done in a kind of VH1 Storytellers songwriter kind of mode.  So that’s what is on that album.

AB:  Tell us about Good Faith.

  RE:  It’s a singer/songwriter collection and the songs accumulated over a long period of time while I was writing instrumental things and I had just sort of decided that I’m not gonna mix singer/songwriter tunes with the guitar/instrumentals.  I would just put the instrumentals on one thing and that would be Handiwork, which was the predecessor to Good Faith.  When you write a collection of songs, after the fact you turn around and say 'okay what is the organic thing that ties this all together' and I think the idea of Good Faith grew out of the fact that the album tries to take a look at a maturing kind of artist of the world and trying to make the world a better place and what the act of songwriting is and what is it that you’re trying to accomplish.  The songs are sort of story songs and in a way the message is one of trying to have a sense of good faith and good will but that’s not to say that they are all exactly like that.

AB:  Do you still write stories and poems?

  RE:  I’ve been working on a novel, slowly! [both laughing] I sit on the board of the Songwriter’s Association so I tend to write letters to editors and draft up a lot of documentation, postings up on discussion forums….  I do tend to do a lot of prose.  I teach it every week at the college so there are things that I have to write for that.  I’ve done curriculum development for a whole song-writing course, which took a lot of writing.  It’s not exactly writing poems and stuff but I still do a little bit of it.  There’s a book, a collection, called Bric A Brac.  It’s a collection of stuff that had accumulated over a long period of time.  I hoping that maybe when I get a little older I’ll have more opportunity to pursue some of those kinds of things. 

AB:  Maybe get to sit on your front porch taking it easy and writing some more!

  RE:  Yeah, exactly.

AB:  How do you feel the Network Shows have been going?

  RE:  Oh I love them!  For me, they’re the best.  To have an intimate circumstance where you can have a whole range of material that’s very kind of intimate.  Playing classical guitar pieces to the point where you can hear a pin drop.  You know, cover the old Triumph stuff with an acoustical version and I’ll usually drag along another guy so I can kind of have somebody to play off of and it’s fun, too.  In a way it’s more liberating than being in a band situation.  Of course, when you are in a band situation you have to follow more fairly rigid format but when I’m playing alone, I can change the set list around if I want to if somebody shouts out a request.  They just seem more responsive.  Just more strongly connected to the spirit, soul, and the heart. 

AB:  That was gonna be my next question –  which you preferred, the intimate club settings or the arena-type venues.  But I think you answered that one – the club settings.

  RE:  Yeah, yeah.  I can enjoy any kind of performance or sitting and I wouldn’t reject any of the nice paychecks you get from playing in a festival and things!  We played some jazz festivals this past summer and sometimes you get invitations to be involved in classic rock things and multi-band bills or large outdoor shows.  I like those, too.  There’s nothing wrong with that.  I like the fact that I get a wide range of performance opportunities.  I think I prefer the solo shows because I get more of a chance to be me. 

AB:  You get to do things your own way and interact more with the crowd.  It’s an awesome situation!

  RE:  You get to have more flexibility and people don’t have the same expectations that they do when you go to see a live band.  They expect that band to be churning through the hits and bashing their way through the songs.  The energy has to stay high and when you do a solo performance, it’s easier to sort of bring it down, play ballads and do different things.

AB:  What do you think about being referred to as a ‘rock guitar god?'

  RE:  Well, I mean, I don’t know.  First of all, it’s nice that some people say things like that and it doesn’t hurt someone’s career having people say things like that.  I really think the pursuit of music and playing an instrument, those things keep you humble.  I don’t consider myself being anywhere close to god-like status [laughing].  I think I struggle along and do what I do, and I think humility is an important aspect of trying to keep chasing the very difficult challenge of the thing.  Maybe that’s what people perceive as being so fantastic.  Again I don’t take anything for granted and I work really hard and people respect that and see that.  I would hate to think that people think I do this because it’s some kind of gymnastic technical exercise.  To me I think it’s really about trying to fill up spaces between people and help them connect to their own spirit and help them connect to someone else’s spirit.  To me that’s what great art and good music should do.  I think if my own personality gets in the way too much then the work doesn’t really speak.  The work has to be the thing that speaks.  So we live in an age of personality and celebrity and hype and people saying all these things about who's number one and who's the most gorgeous woman in the world – I don’t know if it’s about competition or who can become a god more faster than the next guy.  I wouldn’t want to get my priorities screwy. 

AB:  Well, I know that the people that are really into what you’re doing appreciate that and that’s the first thing that comes across in the music.  You’re out there doing it for the love of the music not to just say how great you are.  People enjoy it because the music actually means something to them. 

  RE:  Thank you. 

AB:  Do you like being in the studio more than playing live?

  RE:  Well, I like them both!  I had an interview earlier today where the guy was saying 'okay guitar, singing, or writing – which one would you pick; if you had to pick one, which would be the most important.'  I think in the end if you’re forced to, I’d pick writing because, you know, as you get older you could get arthritis or you could loose a couple of fingers or my pipes might not stay the same, and as I get older I’ve already noticed that.  Of course, you can always write.  Writing is the creative thing.  So I think that’s the core.  So that means that, in fact, if I did have to choose, I guess I’d choose the studio because that’s where you’ll realize the writing.  But don’t ask me to have to give up performing – I’m addicted to that! [both laughing]  I’ve been a big hambone ever since as a little kid and that’s all a part of that.  I think the music becomes most engaged when it’s performed live and that it can be a very intense kind of connection, too.  But I think the live performance is the most engaging.

AB:  Are there any other styles of music you would like to explore that you haven’t?

  RE:  No, but there is some stuff that I would like to revisit and maybe re-energize myself and reinvent myself.  I still feel like I have a classical guitar CD in me and I would like to do a progressive rock album at some point which is more focused on the electric guitar and a rhythm section circumstance.  I really enjoy doing what I’m doing right now.  I would just like to be able to keep doing what I’m doing.  I mean, I’m going to be singing in a musical in November and that’s an interesting new challenge and it’s nice to get new challenges.

AB:  All right.  What’s the musical about?

  RE:  Frankenstein.

  AB:  Okay, I was gonna ask if that was the one.  I had read about something like that on your web site.

  RE:  It’s not exactly full blown Andrew Lloyd Weber but it’s headed in that direction – it’s a big production sort of thing.  I’m not Dr. Frankenstein or the Monster – I’m sort of the third guy on the bill, I’m the Captain of the ship.  It’s written in the same fashion as the Mary Shelley novel.  The ship’s stuck in the ice and all of a sudden this weird doctor shows up and starts to tell this unbelievably crazy story about building this monster and, of course, it’s hard to believe that it’s true – then the monster shows up and that’s kind of the story.  I end up sort of being the book end; I’m kind of like the master of ceremonies – I introduce the beginning and how the story starts and then go back stage and sit for a hour and a half and then come out and sing a little bit.

AB:  How very cool!  Would you ever want to be a part of a group again?  Like maybe a super group like Damn Yankees, etc.?

  RE:  Nope!  Not to say that every now and then getting involved in a project where I might only have to be a guitar player in a band doing something but I would never want to commit to it and have it become my sole priority.  There’s an opportunity to do a little project where there’s this hockey show in Canada and they like to have bands come in and record versions of their theme songs so that they can intercut hockey highlights with a rock band performing.  But when they pitched me, I knew a drummer and a bass player that were friends of mine and I said 'look we can go in and we can do this' so it’s being negotiated and it may happen and it may not.  We’ll just split the money three ways and it would be like a power trio and it would fun.  So every now and then if the opportunity presents itself I could see it.  I definitely don’t want to be in a situation where you have other guys that are writing and they’re saying 'okay we’re gonna project this kind of image and we have to look this kind of way and we have to record these kinds of songs and we have to sound this kind of style.'  Oh no.  I outgrew that a long time ago.

AB:  Is it harder to write songs than before, not wanting to repeat yourself?

  RE:  Well, I think that with most things in life, it goes in cycles.  I mean, if you ask me one day I might say 'no, no' – it’s just a natural organic process and I just let the cards fall where they may – and then you might ask me the next week and I might go 'oh, it’s a gigantic pain in the butt and I don’t seem to be coming up with anything original and it’s hard and it seems like it’s getting harder all the time.'  I think that as you get older you’re not as satisfied because you’ve got a stronger sense of your discriminating taste.  So you do tend to be a little choosier and little bit more careful and maybe it makes you move a little bit slower and you’re not necessarily inclined to get all enthusiastic about a song that you found out that someone wrote 55 years ago! [both laughing]  Now having said that, you also have a lot of experience in your own process so then you realize 'okay, when I’m ready and when I’m gonna settle down and focus on the process, I’ll know what it is that I want and how to get there.'  And I do think that in the earlier stages of writing for an album or putting together a body of work, it does go a little quicker and it does get a little easier.  Now having said that, when you get down to the really short strokes and the details, now you’re turning into an old fussbudget again and it’s very hard to please yourself when you’re trying to finish something off.  So I think it's a little bit of both. 

------ I would like to say thank you to Rik for taking the time out to do this interview.  We look forward to seeing him here in Dallas on October 25^th at Poor David’s Pub.  Also check out Rik’s web site at www.rikemmett.com.

  – Amy Burch, NeonBlonde.com

  ---Photos and additional info courtesy of RikEmmett.com.

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